It may be a little to late

I’m an Objectivist, Atheist, Capitalist, total fan of America in the classic, original, Empire State loving way, enthusiastically in favor of Truth, Justice and the American Way. Yes, there is an American Way. And, no, it’s not some other way adapted to a new situation. It is a new way, fresh, clean and sane, healthy and good way of doing things and coming at problems.

The American Dream. It exists. Americans gave birth to the possibility of its true existence and enjoyment. The best thing about the American Dream is that Americans turned their Dream into their Reality. History will bless you forever for having done this. Good people. Even if you have decided to abandon and renounce it. America existed. It will never be denied. And if you follow the current path to its logical conclusion and go voluntarily into the socialist slavery that your current leaders are proposing to you, there will come a day when, somewhere, people will rediscover Freedom, Truth, Justice and the American Way and America will live, again, either in its current geographical location or in another.

I know what you are thinking “don’t write us off, yet”. I won’t. The situation looks dark, though. You have put your neck on the guillotine and trusting the good will of the executioner not to pull the lever is not what I would call wise.

The slow but constant power of propaganda and education, immensely corrupt but education at last, has given us the sad spectacle of the freest and most powerful nation ever in the history of our species giving in voluntarily to slave drivers like that woman who in the clutches of a rapist gives in to his promise that if she just lets him tie her hands to that bolt on the wall he won’t hurt her and stops struggling. How can America fall for that?!

The America that defeated nazi Germany, fascist Japan and finally the Soviet Union, giving in to a pack of provincial chicken thieves?!

You have let your own good be turned against you. What the Schmeissers and Mousers and Arisakas and Kalashnikovs couldn’t do, a few socialist clowns and liars got away with, without a scratch.

Do you think that’s democracy? That’s demopathy, a disease of democracy that allows parasitic entities to take democracy over and turn all that makes democracy good into bad, all that makes democracy sane into crazy, Freedom into slavery, pride into shame, truth into lie, the good into the bad, and, perversely, the bad into the good. The rats have taken over the ship and strut their stuff around like the ship belongs to them and even more, like they have built it and nobody ever helped. The world belongs to the rats!

The non producing parasites are dictating to the producers what is “owed” to them. And they’ll be seeing if they ever allow the producers to go on producing again and what and how much and how and at what price and to whom to sell it to.

What a thrill it must be for every “never-got-there”, for every “never-made-it”, for every “nobody-ever-gave-me-a-break”, for every parasite, to feel that “his gang” is in power and is going to dictate terms to those he KNOWS to be his betters, those he could never understand, those he could never even imitate, those he pretended not to admire while all the time since his memory can reach spying on them like a child with his nose pressed against a window.

And not the saddest but maybe the most ironic of it is that the parasites in power are not going to give a hoot about him nor could they even if they wanted to because their ignorance and their immorality are going to bring everybody down into the cesspool of a socialist regime without making much of a distinction between friend and foe.

Because socialism is like a doomsday machine, like the grenade of last resort, the suicide weapon to, at least, take your enemies with you. Socialism has NEVER achieved more than pittance and shame, long lines to buy nothing with a currency so inflated that’s more joke than currency and all in the name of a “social justice” that’s not “social” and it’s not “justice”.

Socialism is the quintessential way to kill the golden eggs laying goose. You can’t steal the wealth of the producers because their wealth is moral and morality can’t be stolen. Wealth is in the mind. It is the flower of human life. If you kill the human and take him apart trying to get for yourself that which made him tick, you find that you can’t.

And the little currency you steal from a dead producer will last you little. And then you’ll starve. Because the maker of food will not be there any more. You killed him.

Like the savage that kills another and eats his heart trying to acquire his bravery, socialists end up with humongous graveyards and a creeping poverty that turns a world of color into the grayness that was East Berlin.

The poor louse that lives in a shanty town thinks that the husseins and the pelosis and the reids and the schummers are going to give him what belonged to somebody else and in his supine ignorance can’t know that the socialists are going to kill that somebody else and eat the corpse and the virtue that made the dead man rich will die with him and all will go down one more notch into the darkness of hunger.

hussein, like an American Mugabe, will go after the best America has to offer and just as the African tyrant is killing or making flee for their lives all those that used to produce food in Rhodesia, he’ll go after all those that produce and know how to produce in America and will persecute them and harass them into extinction and America will loose it’s soul.

This demopathy leads to the zombiefication of America. And the zombiefication is well underway.

The libtard demopaths think that America is something that oozes out of the bones of producers and are willing to reduce them to skeletons and “make them” give up their wealth by grinding their remains.

I wonder how many over there understand just how incomprehensible all this sounds to America’s friends abroad? Your friends abroad are simply saying “how could they . . . how?!!”

Ayn Rand’s “Atlas Shrugged” was never so necessary for you guys, as it is today. Small wonder it is climbing the ranks as it is. It may be a little too late, though. Hope not.

Socialism works perfectly. The United States Army the most pristine example of socialism. Its been working for hundreds of years. There are many facets of socialism that we all love... The USPS, Ambulence Services, Police services, Health services, etc. Socialism is far more fair than capitalism. If you think that gov. DE-regulation is the answer and 110% free market economies are the right way to go then thank Bush and all those in the past years that had a hand in making it easier for blood-sucking capitalists to rape the ordinary worker, and take advantage of him. Time and time again.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

I assume you have paid for your college education. I would get a lawyer and sue. You’ve been screwed. They promised you rabbit and gave you a cat instead.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

Let’s review it briefly, shall we?

The USSR, the Union of Socialist Soviet Republics failed miserably.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

nazi Germany failed miserably. BTW, in case you didn’t know, “nazi” means “national socialist”

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

North Korea is a socialist country.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

Cuba is a socialist country.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

Venezuela is being turned into a socialist country.

Socialism works? No, it doesn’t.

China is a socialist country. The only part of China that works is the one they have allowed to become non-socialist.

Get a lawyer and sue. You have been had. They stole your money.

Get your facts straight and start all over.

Socialism doesn’t work. It never did. It never will.

Socialism doesn’t work because it is anti-human.

Socialism is anti Freedom.

Socialism requires that an individual renounces that which makes him human, his brain.

Socialism is just another name for institutionalized slavery.

Socialism is institutionalized parasitism.

Socialism is institutionalized stupidity.

If socialism is imposed upon you by force, you are a victim and you can hope for rebellion and Freedom.

If you accept and go into socialism voluntarily then you are amongst the most depraved a human can get to be. You voluntarily renounce your humanity to become a beast of burden to be milked at will by your masters or slaughtered and quartered and consumed by your masters. In any case you gave your life for nothing unless you consider the low lives of the worms that will eat you alive worth sacrificing your life for.

So you think socialism works? You are about to find out because Americans have chosen socialism and are experiencing it right know. The hussein’s porkulous bill is socialism at its best. And it’s only the beginning. You are going to have a real education bestowed upon you by reality. Not the interminable string of meaningless words your communist teachers have given you in exchange for your money but the education that comes from facts.

I'll have to take sides with Jorge on this one. He's put it bluntly enough. thekill, by your own admission, you've compared Socialism to the likes of military services. While the other services you've mentioned are more mild, and hell, even the military isn't what it used to be... still, the US Military is a war machine plain and simple. Socialistic ideas are instilled so that the machine operates more smoothly, however, even a soldier deserves a break.

Postal workers and police officers go home for the night, have weekends off, take vacations. Soldiers have leave and R&R. In a Socialist governed society, especially to the degree of Nazi Germany or Communist Russia, China, etc.... there is no break, no freedoms. The ideas behind such societies may have been good in theory... but those in power will never let the theories work towards full development.

We are constantly losing more and more of our liberties, due to "safety" concerns, or whatever else have you. We are told daily that these things are for our own good. We are watched, listened to, and basically distrusted on every level. Each generation will lose more freedom and there will always be a silly excuse as to why. We tend to settle into these. With the help of the govt and media it will not take long until we are literally scared to death of God only knows what. What's next? Uniforms? Papers please?

While I'll agree that we need something... outright socialism is just not the answer to our problems. The price in the end will be just too damn high.

OK, I have a little more time now.

About the military, and we are talking about the USA military, this a contractual relationship people enter freely by mutual consent of all involved and for mutual benefit. The rights of all the parties involved are protected as they should be. Nobody forces you to enter and nobody can keep you inside once you have fulfilled your contractual obligations.

Socialism is a system that is based (and it could not be based on anything else by its very nature) on a systematic violation of the rights of the individual.

If there was anything voluntary in socialism then it would not be socialism and all socialist regimes would end up with a few hard liners eating each other for lack of anything else edible.

There’s a reason why ALL socialist regimes close their doors and don’t allow people to leave and it’s simply that socialism is so poisonous to human nature that people would leave in any manner they could given the least chance.

The Soviet Union was a jail. People wanted out.

nazi Germany was a jail. People wanted out.

Fascist Japan was a jail. People wanted out.

North Korea is a jail. People want out.

Cuba is a jail. People want out.

China is a jail. People want out.

Why do people want out of socialism? Because socialism is bad for them. Because socialism DOESN’T WORK.

When you are going to victimize human beings, you have to lock them up otherwise they just leave and you end up alone and with no victims. That’s no fun for a socialist. You can’t be a socialist on your own. A socialist is a cannibal. Without humans he starves. A socialist needs his food: humans. So he has to turn the country into a corral, to keep his animals inside.

People are willing to risk their lives and die if necessary to escape socialism. Why is that? You haven’t asked yourself that question? Man . . .

On the other hand, people are more than willing to enter those countries where Freedom is respected, the rights of the individual recognized and human nature can flourish.

Just look at Cubans throwing themselves into the Caribbean with little more than a floating bag of some kind and paddling with their hands, braving the sharks and exposure to abandon socialism and to reach the coast of the United States. If that spectacle doesn’t tell you something turn in your brain, you have no use for it.

And don’t call the USA military “socialist”. That’s an offense to the best military in the world. Many excellent men of the USA military have died so you can enjoy your Freedoms. Don’t insult them.

I don’t think you have the least idea about what socialism is and is not.

Get a lawyer. Sue your college. You have been cheated.

The US Military used to be much more strict than they are now. Now you say, "I want out." and you get out. It used to not be that way. Also... with the drafts, there were times when soldiers did not enter into that contract, but were forced into it. I agree... many brave people died so that freedom could be enjoyed... but I do agree with theKill on the fact that the US Military instilled socialistic methods to accomplish what they needed. Like I said, these things have gotten easier, but overbearing discipiline is what was needed to make the wheels of the big machine go 'round.

I know there used to be a draft. And that was socialism. And it was wrong. And it was changed.

America used to be just the least socialist of all the socialist countries because all countries are socialist. There is an overwhelmingly important matter of degree in this socialism that is shared by all countries. As to America it used to be the freest of all countries and by the same token, the least socialist. That has been changed by the sad arrival of hussein and his orcs. Americans are going to experience socialism first hand, now. See how you like it.

Socialism in the political organization of societies is like poison in the food. A little, very little, can be tolerated by most individuals without any deleterious effect. That’s why, the least socialist of all societies, America, was able to flourish and become the envy and the model for all those who aspired at Freedom. That was before hussein. Now America will become as socialist as any eurabian socialist country.

As to a pure Capitalist society, as far as I know, it hasn’t existed yet but there’s no practical impediment.

I don’t know why you call military methods “socialistic”. If you get into a situation that involves certain rules and you do so by your own accord and nobody forces you and there’s a way to get out and it is for the mutual benefit of all involved then there’s nothing “socialistic” about it. It is just a contract and it carries certain obligations as all contracts do. Where’s the “socialistic” about it?

And what would the alternative be? Without the discipline, can you get a military that wins wars? I don’t think so. Why you would call military discipline “socialist methods” is behind me.

America has the best military ever. And it is composed of citizen-soldiers. Free people who chose a dangerous profession and perform superlatively. Why? Because they are free people. Or at least were free people. Things are changing.

I recently read a simple question asked by an old soldier:

If you needed your life and your freedoms to be defended from an attacking pack of cannibals, who would you rather choose to do the defending, ten little ignorant collectivists fresh out of any American libtard college, sporting che guevara t-shirts, or ten soldiers of equivalent age that are currently fighting in Afghanistan, each with an American flag on his shoulder?

There you go.

I will respond to this thread more vividly a little later this afternoon men. I have a briefing to attend here shortly. GREAT discussion though.

Jorge_Banner wrote:

I know there used to be a draft. And that was socialism. And it was wrong. And it was changed.

And that, my friend, is where it is not so cut and dry. The reason the drafts ended is because the wars did. However, even now, every male US citizen has to sign up for Selective Service at age 18 and they have to carry that card till I think 25 now... it used to be 35. This is in case of another draft. It is not voluntary... it is mandatory.

You can say you want out now, and you can leave... but not so many years ago... that just wasn't an option. However, yes, signing up was voluntary, and you would not believe some of the tactics used to get young men to sign up. I never wrote that the US Military was a socialist organization... I merely said that they do instill some socialistic ideas, which they do. There is middle ground... it doesn't always have to be a case of either / or.

That aside.... yes, discipline is much needed. I wished it were not so lax now. I wish it were every bit as hard as it used to be. I have the utmost respect for all of our fighting forces. I'm not knocking them buddy, so don't even fool yourself for a second. No need to make mountains out of molehills on this one. We can agree to agree.

Just for the fun of it you guys might want to take a look here.

I know, I know, it was corrected by somebody whose English is so better than mine (sigh).

Jorge_Banner wrote:

Just for the fun of it you guys might want to take a look here.

I know, I know, it was corrected by somebody whose English is so better than mine (sigh).

Damn amigo... there's nothing wrong with your English from my standpoint... you should try reading KnifePuppet's posts on the JD sometime. I love the guy... but his English and sentence structure really suffers. He lives in China... yesterday I was posting to him about Karl Marx, in Chinese... http://www.jerzeedevil.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51426

SoToo wrote:

Jorge_Banner wrote:

Just for the fun of it you guys might want to take a look here.

I know, I know, it was corrected by somebody whose English is so better than mine (sigh).

Damn amigo... there's nothing wrong with your English from my standpoint... you should try reading KnifePuppet's posts on the JD sometime. I love the guy... but his English and sentence structure really suffers. He lives in China... yesterday I was posting to him about Karl Marx, in Chinese... http://www.jerzeedevil.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51426

KP is a truly stand-up guy!

SoToo wrote:

Jorge_Banner wrote:

Just for the fun of it you guys might want to take a look here.

I know, I know, it was corrected by somebody whose English is so better than mine (sigh).

Damn amigo... there's nothing wrong with your English from my standpoint... you should try reading KnifePuppet's posts on the JD sometime. I love the guy... but his English and sentence structure really suffers. He lives in China... yesterday I was posting to him about Karl Marx, in Chinese... http://www.jerzeedevil.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51426

Mmmm . . . I sometimes think my English is passable until somebody corrects me, like in this case, and just try and find a rock to crawl under

Jorge, and I do understand socialism. Socialism is an economic system characterized by public ownership and
centralized planning of all major industries (manufacturing, services,
and energy), banks and insurance companies, agribusiness,
transportation, the media, and medical facilities. Under capitalism,
these giant enterprises dominate the economy but are privately owned
and operated for the purpose of generating wealth for their owners by
extracting it from working people who are paid only a small fraction of
what their labor produces. Socialism turns this around so that the
class that produces the wealth can collectively decide how it will be
used for the benefit of all. Real socialism is, by definition, democratic. It is economic as well as
political democracy. Many capitalist countries boast of their
democratic institutions, but this is an illusion because all the
political power is in the hands of those who hold the wealth. Socialism
prioritizes human needs and eliminates the profit motive that drives
war, ecological destruction, and inequalities based on gender, race,
nationality and sexuality. Like capitalism, socialism must be international so that global
resources can be shared. No country can be truly independent of the
global economy because until capitalism is defeated internationally it
will continue to sabotage efforts to build socialism. Achieving
socialism in the United States, the wealthiest and most powerful
country in the world, is necessary to any country being able to
determine its own destiny. There are various types and sects of socialists as well. Most socialists identify themselves as Marxists in recognition
of Karl Marx, who discovered the economic laws underlying capitalism.
Marx and his lifelong collaborator Frederick Engels laid the foundation
of Marxist economics, the philosophical concept of dialectical
materialism, and the method of social analysis known as historical
materialism. Leninism denotes the concepts of a disciplined, revolutionary
party and the principled, intransigent vision of Vladimir Ilyich Lenin,
key leader of the 1917 Russian Revolution. Lenin's works on
imperialism, the nature of the state, and the rights of national
minorities are essential components of the socialist tradition. Then we have Trotskyism. Trotskyism is the continuation of the Marxist and Leninist
current led by Leon Trotsky, co-leader with Lenin of the Russian
Revolution. When the Stalinist bureaucracy rose to power in the Soviet
Union in the late 1920s, Trotsky rallied an international Left
Opposition against the betrayal of the revolution's goals. Trotskyism
stands for Permanent Revolution, internationalism, and the strategy of
the united front against fascism. Trotsky was murdered by a Stalinist
assassin in 1940. And lastly, Socialist feminism was developed in the late 1960s and early 1970s by founders of the Freedom Socialist Party and Radical Women.
It is a Marxist, Leninist, and Trotskyist tendency that acknowledges
that the most oppressed sector of the modern working class is composed
of women, particularly women of color, whose life experience of
exploitation gives them the strength and determination to carry through
a revolution against all forms of oppression. Socialist feminists
recognize the revolutionary leadership of workingclass women, people of
color, and queers, and others multiply afflicted by capitalism.
Socialist feminists orient to grassroots, rank-and-file women and men
rather than to the predominantly white male aristocrats of labor who
make up the union bureaucracy. Several currents that emerged from the socialist and communist
movements have lost their revolutionary character and misstate the
basic principles of socialism's founders. These include: social-democrats, socialist reformers who support mere electoral revision of the capitalist system; Stalinists,
who arose out of the Soviet bureaucracy as supporters of Stalin's
brutal dictatorship and who advocate peaceful co-existence with
capitalism and immersion in bourgeois parties; and Maoists, China-oriented Stalinists, who frequently describe themselves as Marxist-Leninists. This is incredibly long-winded, but you get the general gist of socialism.

Quote :

Real socialism is, by definition, democratic.

Man, you have so much BS in your brain that I seriously doubt I'm going to be able to help you.

I'll try. And for that we are going to have to take the time to talk about the real world, not about your brainwashing.

I would like to put you in front of a long line of victims of socialism and each of them would slap you so hard your teeth would end up orbiting the Earth together with the Moon.

Only a spoiled American or eurabian kid with no real world experience can talk about murder and pillage and called them "democratic".

And all that BS like "revolutionary leadership of workingclass women". You have been taught to play with words like a child plays with colored marbles. All that means cr@p in the real world.

I have many friends in Socialist nations and they are perfectly content.

Sweden, Germany, France, Norway, Finland, Denmark. Not to mention Canada and the UK. All of which have many socialist practices that work well for them. This bash-socialism rant is nothing more than conservative fodder. And moreover, because I dont share your political views, Im brainwashed??? Cmon. Give me a break.

One of the first signs of an anti-Semite is the guy telling you "ooooooooh yeah . . . I have many Jewish friends!" Sure. That won't work man. Saying "ooooooh the thinga's goooooood" won't make it any less bad. Hey, I have many Martian friends that told me that they have left socialism behind cause it don't work. There.

eurabians commited moral and political suicide when they created the EU. They are not happier for it and on the contrary, their lives have turned into a hell of regulations and impediments. The eurabians are riding the express elevator to hell. The EU will end up in war. Mark my words.

And then there's the multiculturalism that the corrupt eurabian socialist elites have forced on the poor sods making them accept a huge bunch of ragheads that are making their lives so miserable not even the police dares to enter some of their zones.

Oh yeah, put the eurabians as example.

As to Canada, let me give you a tip: why do Canadians go the the old USA to get medical attention? Don't their system of socialized medicine work good enough for them?